"Not That Into You" chapter 11 notes

Continuing the series of posts revealing what my brain did when I read "He's Just Not That Into You". Just to clarify: I have now finished reading the book, all the "as I went along" notes like this post and the previous 11 posts have been written. It goes up to chapter 18 so seven more of these. Then you get to see the final, polished, article - the condensed version that is normally all you see when I write a book review or response blog post. I hope this is revealing to you guys about how my brain sees stuff?

Anyway, on with the show:

Same abbreviations as before:

G.B. = Greg Behrendt (author)
L.T. = Liz Tuccillo (author)

Chapter 11: …if he's a selfish jerk, a bully, or a really big freak. (If you really love someone, you want to do things to make that person happy)

Okay, buttons pushed here: plenty of people think I'm a "really big freak" and while I accept that I am rather big (self-identified "tubby bitch"!) I reject that my being a BDSM sadist/Dominant – or being somewhat gender-deviant – makes me a freak. So, really unsure about this chapter to start with…

G.B.: Forget all his good qualities/bad qualities/excuses/promises. "Ask yourself one question only: Is he making you happy? … I don't mean some of the time, on rare occasions, not that often, 'but the good still outweighs the bad.' Does he make it clear in his actions every day that your happiness is important to him?"

Mostly agree, especially the last sentence. Sometimes even if you can't make someone happy you can still be showing all the time that hir happiness is important. Because there are hard times for every couple, so sometimes "happy" is not an option, but those times should be the exception because always working out how to make that happiness come back soonest.

Excuses/scenarios covered:

'He's really trying to be better':
Scenario: He never does anything to help or to make special times, swears he's trying to change but it's not noticeable.

G.B.: "He may think he loves you, and maybe he does. But he's really bad at it."

I think, if you love someone, you figure out how to do it well. I think he's in love with the idea of you, but not with you the person – which is (as G.B. says) pretty much the same as not being into you.

'It's just the way he was brought up':
Scenario: he doesn't like families, in particular, is not liking (not making an effort to like) hers.

G.B.: "He doesn't have to like your CD collection. He doesn't have to love your shoes. But any good, mature guy better make an attempt to love your friends and family"

I'm going to say that there are some families in this world I am never going to be able to like, or attempt to like – e.g. if most of them are racist scumbags, and I happen to be dating the only non-racist member of the family (or something). And I think that kind of situation merits some allowance for us guys! (I mean, do I now have to find not only a girlfriend who's feminist, but her whole family is too!?) I'm pretty good (maybe too good) at biting my tongue and keeping quiet in such situations, but you can bet I become sullen and unfriendly in them!

But serious political disagreements or personality clashes besides, yeah – at least make an effort!

'It's not always going to be like this':
He's tired/stressed – shouts at her if woken/interrupted in the middle of something. Apologises every so often, and tells her it's only until project/exams/whatever are over.

My reaction: This is how DV stories start. They end in DV refuges, hospitals or worse. This scenario is seriously scary. She needs to GET THE FUCK OUT OF THERE NOW!

G.B.: "People who yell are people with anger issues who need help. People who yell are people who think they're entitled to yell."

Precisely. And that sort of person can so easily become an abuser just like that. **snaps fingers**

G.B.: "Do you want to be that couple? You know – that couple where the guy yells at his wife all the time? Even better, do you want him to be that dad?"

After all, that produces the next generation of wife-beaters.

'It's behind closed doors that counts':
Scenario: He's nice in private, but puts her down, insults her education/intelligence in front of friends etc.

My reaction: he's on a serious (and non-consensual) power-trip here, and one of the most creepy sorts of abuser there are, because it's so easy for him to deny it (but he's clearly making himself feel good at her expense).

Now, it mentions "correcting grammar" as one of the things he does, and I do that a lot – but I take no pleasure from it, and actually feel guilty when I blurt it out sometimes. Red Pen Syndrome is an affliction, and one that I am careful to control when necessary.

Did online-only thing with a woman for a while, who explained to me that she liked being free when not at work to be sloppy and eccentric in her use of English – so I always let it slide with her (despite the temptation always not to). So, if he does it even though he knows it bothers you – then he's a grade-A jerk.

G.B.: "Why should you care if he treats you better when you're alone? Because it sounds like he can't wait to get you out in public just so he can humiliate you."

Precisely.

'But he's just trying to help':
Scenario: She's trying to lose weight, he says what she can/can't eat, if she wants to cheat says it goes on her big butt, points out when she gains weight (or loses it).

My reaction: This is, again, a total power trip in the worst possible way. He's feeding on her insecurities about her weight to become an emotional vampire and take control of her life in non-consensual ways. (Hey, radfems who say BDSM is sub women self-deceiving about their role: here's what that REALLY looks like, and BDSM really doesn't look like.)

G.B. (basically repeats what I just said, minus the radfem part)

G.B. – taking last three together: "It's hard to feel worthy of love when someone is going out of their way to make you worthless. Being told to get out of these relationships may not work for you. Knowing that you're better than these relationships is the place to start."

Two points:

Firstly, why is there nowhere in this book any info on resources for women in/getting out of abusive relationships?

Secondly: He's not going "out of his way" to make her feel worthless: it's precisely his means to an end, it's exactly his way, and he'll do it to anyone he can get his claws into.

'But now I'm playing in the big leagues':
Scenario: he's so amazing, loads of wonderful stories – but never asks about her.

G.B.: "He's not into you; he's into how you look listening to him… When two people are connecting, they hunger for information about each other."

Definitely.

I know it's very easy to talk about myself for ages, but if there's any interest at all in her, I want to ask her things and I break off my self-descriptions to find out about her. In fact, sometimes very frustrated now when she's reticent about it!

"You're the catch. They are out to snare you."

I'm not keen on this formulation (which pervades G.B.'s advice, it seems) that only men do the chasing, women are passive recipients of men's lust and interest. But you have to view yourself as being at least as interesting as the other person.

'He's just finding himself':
Scenario: He's long-term unemployed, "just doesn't know what he wants to do with his life." She supports him with her income/money. "Or maybe he's just depressed?"

G.B.: "A man who's really into you and himself will try to get his act together a fast as he can. That means, first and foremost, collecting a salary."

Okay, I too am long-term unemployed, and I resent the implication by G.B. that a man is only "together" or worth anything, if he has a paying job.

There's a big difference between "lazy" and "wants to work but not being offered any jobs".

G.B.: "People go through rough patches all the time… The only job you need to worry about is the job of finding someone who would be never be that comfortable living off you and your family's money."

True story: every time I visit my parents, I have to fight my dad because he wants to give me money to help with my budget. And the money is useful, for sure – but I always try hard to refuse it - I end up caving, because I can't deny it's useful, but it always makes me uncomfortable.

And I would never be comfortable living off someone else's income, at least, unless I was able to contribute meaningfully to the household in some way on a daily basis. But G.B. is very heavy on this idea of the guy as the breadwinner somehow – there seems to be no room in his philosophy for the Stay-At-Home-Dad.

I think this is the crucial thing: is he even trying to contribute?

Also: if he is suffering from depression, then it's possible that counts as "emotionally unavailable", depending on the state and the phase. Whatever, it's likely to be a hard road to travel if you stick with him, and he should certainly get diagnosed and get professional help (whether talk therapies or medication) to get over it.

I certainly think people with depression are capable of having meaningful and serious relationships, but from my own experiences of the disease, I know that it can be tough at times for both. So make sure you're getting the support you and he need.

'Maybe it's just his little quirk':

Hmm, lots of things could be considered "little quirks", and only some of them should be considered as something more…

Given that the chapter heading was "if he's a really big freak", I'm guessing this is something else.

Situation presented: he doesn't like being touched (but does have sex with her); she really likes physical intimacy (cuddles, touching etc).

G.B.: "He may be really into you, but he's certainly not really compatible with you." … "You will meet people who don't like to be touched, or kissed, or who don't like sex. You can spend a lot of time trying to fix them… Or you can realize that they simply don't like to do the things you find absolutely essential to your enjoyment of life, and then go out and find someone who does."

This is why I can't really date 'nillas. D/s especially is absolutely essential to my enjoyment of life, and S/M is right up there as well, so vanilla sex will never be right for me. Of course, finding someone who does enjoy these things is easier said than done!

In general terms, agree that finding someone who's compatible sexually is important (and "physical intimacy" can be an extension of sexuality, I think).

The rare and exotic 'He's Afraid of the intimacy of sleep':
Situation: a year into a relationship, he's still not sleeping in the same bed as her: after sex, sleeps on the couch.

G.B.: he's a freak, get rid of him.

I'd say something's not right in the relationship, but I wouldn't call the guy a freak. Whatever his issues are, though, they're now affecting her. This is a special case of the point in "just his little quirk" above: it's not a compatible situation, so you need to find someone else.

G.B.: "If you date, you will meet your share of weirdos and jerks… The only thing in your control is how long you allow these gentlemen to take up space in your life."

Point not acknowledged by G.B.: definitions of "weirdo" may vary. Making someone feel bad for being different from you is Not Okay.

L.T. 'Here's Why This One Is Hard':

There aren't that many good men out there.

"There are more good women out there than good men."

Sceptical about this. Then again, depends on definition of "good". And how definition varies according to gender.

Means can't all end up with "great men who love us and whom we love back, where there's a passionate mutual attraction, who also treat us like queens."

You don't want me to treat you like a queen. I'm anti-monarchy: for me, treating you like a queen would be cutting off your head!

Therefore, seems logical to lower expectations. Especially if hate being single.

"Obviously, I don't think people should go out with someone who is abusive to them. But there are subtle degrees of abuse… These guys… They're not just assholes. They can be nice sometimes, too. And there are many days when I personally think it's better to be with someone your friends hate but will help you carry in the groceries than be alone."

"Greg, you have to take over."

G.B. Responds:

"Being lonely, being alone, for many people, sucks. I get it."

Statistics can only frighten you, and thus keep you down, so don't use them.

"It's your life - how dare you not have faith in it!"

Jeez, maybe because thus far it's given us very little reason to have faith in it? (Oh, wait – I'm a man anyway, so I automatically have confidence according to G.B.)

"…we are all tired of operating from a place of fear. You want to believe you are better than all the crap… Well you are. You are an excellent, foxy human being worthy of love…"

Wait, what? Only the foxy are worthy of love!?

"I know you can get lonely. I know you can crave companionship and sex and love so badly that it physically hurts. But I truly believe that the only way you can find out that there's something better out there is to first believe there's something better out there."

Well, indeed. Of course, nothing wrong with answering a sex craving with a bit of no-stings-attached stuff, and friends are good for companionship too.

But yeah, believe that there will be an answer and maybe there will be. Stop believing, and there definitely won't.

G.B.: 'This is what it should look like'

Female friend is scared of clowns, her husband makes sure "she never sees one or is near one". He "still wants to protect his wife from things that frighten her."

This is probably just me, but I find that quite creepy, really. It seems like making her dependent upon him and unable to stand on her own. For me, the loving thing to do would be to be there to support her when she needed it, and to help her gain the strength in herself to deal with her fear – that is, to stop fear limiting her. The above example sounds to me like a power trip of the "He's just trying to help" variety.